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RE: Different Writing Types and Checklists


Chronological Thread 
  • From: "SARA, Deb" <dsara1 AT eq.edu.au>
  • To: ictenglish AT mailinglist.tki.org.nz
  • Subject: RE: Different Writing Types and Checklists
  • Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 11:29:19 +1000

Craig , I refer to the following words from your great link:
" 'Write a haiku using only the words you can find on the racing page of
the Evening Post.' And so, in 1977, Helen Gabites wrote this:

A tamed life moored in
shifting dark horizons, this
quiet lady.

My memory is that we were all surprised by the quality of the work this
exercise produced. But of course we shouldn't have been. New Zealand's
best words are there on the racing page: much of the nation's most
strenuous creative endeavour has gone into the task of naming horses. We
were beginning to enter the gaming halls of the imagination. Soon I was
asking people to make large cardboard dice, write words on them and
throw short poems:...etc"

My input:
I still don't think the words on the sports page are the unknown.
Particularly if students have a choice of the ones they are going to
use. They will use the ones that attract them for some reason. So yes, I
agree, Craig, it is imaginative, but I would also assert it is not what
they don't know. It seems impossible to write about what we don't know.
To do so would result in nonsense I'd imagine.
The constructivist learning theories are helpful in this regard, I
believe. From memory our aim in teaching using constructivist theories
is to let kids have control of/negotiate their own learning, to make
meaning of texts, to make choices, but also in a real context. So the
idea of writing about the unknown while it is unkonwn seems a bit
strange, in that frame work, which is the frame work we are encouraged
to follow, as far as I am aware. Claire, you might be able to clarify
that.
I recently read about a teacher in northern Australia teaching
Aboriginal kids to write about "little bears". I did that in the 1960s
in Qld. The little bears weren't koala bears, I can tell you. They were
little European bears. That is an example of writing about the unknown-
although not the type of unknown the previous threads were imaging I'm
sure - and apparently still happening to the most disadvantaged of Qld
students, in at least one instance.
Cheers!
DEB


-----Original Message-----
From: Liz Dench
[mailto:ldench AT hillcrest-high.school.nz]

Sent: Wednesday, 26 May 2010 11:02 AM
To:
ictenglish AT mailinglist.tki.org.nz
Subject: Re: Different Writing Types and Checklists

I have used these strategies for some time and call " Write what you
know" - /Experience/ and "Write what you don't know" - /Experiment/.
This works well.
Liz Dench



Craig Martin wrote:
> 'Mutes & Earthquakes' is here:
> http://www.poetrykit.org/magazine/manhire.htm Well worth a read.
>
> Craig
>
> On 26 May, 2010, at 12:06 PM, Cameron Fisher wrote:
>
> I think probably everyone is right. Bill Manhire discusses the idea of

> writing what you know */and /*what you don't know in the introduction
> to the "Mutes and Earthquakes" anthology of student work. I think this

> is also published online somewhere - probably accessible through the
> VUW website (going from memory here - and that's certainly not what it

> once was).
>
> *From:* Bufton & Co
> [mailto:s.bufton AT xnet.co.nz]
>
> *Sent:* 25 May 2010 22:28
> *To:*
> ictenglish AT mailinglist.tki.org.nz
>
> <mailto:ictenglish AT mailinglist.tki.org.nz>
> *Subject:* RE: Different Writing Types and Checklists
>
> What do you mean by "kids shouldn't be making it up!" If kids only
> ever write about what they know then how will we ever produce anymore
> novelists. Kids love to make up stories and use their imaginations.
> Unfortunately many of them get little or no opportunity to do so. Some

> of the best student writing I have ever read was completely fictional.

> Heaven forbid that we only encourage them to write what they know!!
> Sue Bufton
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Craig Martin
> [mailto:craig AT e-learning.net.nz]
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, 25 May 2010 4:21 p.m.
> *To:*
> ictenglish AT mailinglist.tki.org.nz
>
> <mailto:ictenglish AT mailinglist.tki.org.nz>
> *Subject:* Re: Different Writing Types and Checklists
>
> By 'creative' writing do you mean 'making it up'? Kid's shouldn't be
> 'making it up'. They should be writing what they know, what they are
> expert in. And kids are expert in lots of things. They have lots to
> write about.
>
> I think the problem here is that teachers don't write. By that I mean
> 'craft' a piece of writing. I think they should, regularly. So when
> the kids sit down to write a poem or a personal narrative, the teacher

> does it too. And not 'let's pretend', but real writing.
>
> And the teacher shares her writing in the same way she expects the
> students to share their writing. Think about how this would improve
> how teachers would approach feedback to students, approach
> conferencing with students. Think, also, about the insights the
> teacher would get into the writing process, into what it feels like to

> be a writer, to have to put your thoughts and ideas out there for all
> to see.
>
> Craig Martin
>
> On 25 May, 2010, at 8:37 AM, Tina Muller wrote:
>
>
> > Craig- I disagree a little, surely when someone writes they do know
> very well who they are writing for/to.I know my father was always
> writing letters of complaint & he knew who he was writing to AND why
> he was writing.
>
> Authors who write books have usually got at least an age range in
> mind. Poetry perhaps could be personal. Perhpas they don't say 'what
> genre' nut they KNOW what genre. As for features if you consder
> writing & running, each has features they can improve on, good
> writers/athletes do KNOW these features.
>
> Letting students write creatively can often just mean time wasting
> unless they are taught genre and then they know what they can write
> and have the ability to write -even if it's 'just' narrative (the most

> difficult) to know features is helpful.
>
> Don't feel depressed - writing is done for a purpose, is part of
> communication & has different genres.
>
> Tina Muller
>
>
>
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